We gotta be we

>> NYC's Cannibal Ox have no problem with their hip hop identity

by SCOTT C

Somewhere between the draining inner-city grind that is the daily routine of people everywhere and the almost neverending crop of well-groomed pop sensations that bombard us everyday lies the truth about Harlem duo Cannibal Ox. MCs Vas and Vordul released their first LP, The Cold Vein, on the NYC-based Def Jux label earlier this year, giving the thugs something else to chew on and introducing a frosty point of view on the day-to-day that has hit home with heads everywhere. It's no surprise that helping the two move even closer to hip hop enlightenment is former Company Flow member El-P. It's his trademark dark 'n' dirty beats that you hear providing the backdrop to the duo's minor-key commentary. The Mirror spoke to Canox MC Vas over the phone from his native New York.



Mirror: What does underground mean to you? The word has been overused and abused for years--

Vas: Underground and commercial are positions. They're not sounds. That was the first fuck-up that blew up. It's like, "So and so just dropped somethin'," and you hear, "Oh yeah? What they on, are they commercial or they underground?" I never liked that, because being commercial or underground don't mean if you're good or bad. Cannibal Ox is underground due to the number of people who know we exist.

M: I understand.

V: You can't be thinking of that shit when you make music. Our shit is global. A kid in Taiwan can understand poverty, if he understands what I'm saying. A kid in Jordan can understand heartbreak because these things are universal, and that's all our music is, universal themes. We deal with poverty, domestic violence, drug abuse. It's not just gonna be a party for an hour. It's not just gonna be battling for an hour. We have fun and laugh, but we also get serious.

M: Is Canox trying to challenge people straight up?

V: People have such a left or right perspective on things. They forget that there's a middle. Or they're so black or so white that they forget that there are grey areas. Canox is just one of them. Me and Vordul are colourful individuals and that's why people don't know where to put us. We're just doin' us. If I'm on TRL, I'm doin' me. If I'm on MTV, BET, Joey's TV, I'm doin' me. I see people who are positive on one hand, but then they curse and they do drugs. They know spiritual paragraphs from religious books, but they also got Penthouse. That's us! And there's nothing people can do about it.

Following the Flow

M: Do you think a lot of artists have a hard time being themselves?

V: They do! Their publicist is telling them one thing. Their DJ is telling them another. Their A&R and label are telling them something else. Fuck it, they sister is telling them something too. Everyone sees what they think they're supposed to do to blow up. Does that apply to Outkast? Does that apply to Radiohead? You just gotta do you. Luck is luck, but skill doesn't blow you up anymore. I know a lot of starvin' niggas that's just as talented as half the industry. It's about skill, who you know--It's a crap table, and they just shakin' the dice.

M: What do you say to people who call you guys "gothic hip hop"?

V: We just do us. I can't help that I'm from the street and I actually read a couple of books in my life. Sorry that bothers a couple of people. They need to grow the fuck up. Not all of us only know drugs and fuckin' pain. Some of us are well-rounded people who happen to still be in the streets. There's nothing you can do about that. That don't mean I'm running up on old ladies, takin' their purse, and that don't mean I'm selling crack. That could just mean I have friends who do that (laughs).

M: Any pressure as you guys carry on after Company Flow?

V: There's no pressure at all. I been making fat music just as long, and those are good friends of mine. There's no pressure at all. We doin' us. We got our own bag of tricks. It just happens that El-P produced both Co-Flo and our first album. Our beats don't sound the same, either.

M: Apples and oranges, man.

V: Exactly. They did them, we do us. There are similar vibes because there are similar truths. There would be pressure if we weren't being us, but that's simply no the case. We just do us. It's all that we can do.

On the Def Jux All-Stars bill, with Aesop Rock, Mr. Lif and Eyedeas & Abilities at Café Campus on Monday, Sept. 10, 9pm, $16